Kieran Jack

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We hope you enjoy the show

Leigh Chalker (00:21):
And a good evening to another Tuesday Chinwag. My name is Lee Chalker. I’m the creator of Battle for Bustle and with a couple of mates of mine, SPIE and Ben Sullivan and Ryan Vallow. We created Ring Around the Rosie so you can get all these things around in the universe. They’re out and about. So I am just going to drop into our very special guest this evening, Kieran. Jack. Hello bud. How are you? It’s lovely to meet you. Hey.

Kieran Jack (00:45):
Hey Lee, nice to meet you. Thanks for having me on the show.

Leigh Chalker (00:47):
Pleasure, man. Pleasure. So before we get into Kieran, I didn’t want to leave him out there hanging in the breeze and stuff and just troop over him with this little introduction and that. But today’s a special day in Comex because the captain of the ship is Mr. Shane Sizzle sle. It’s his birthday today. So before I get started, I just wanted to wish Shane very happy birthday. Hope he’s had a lovely day, and thank you very much for Chinwag just coming up on your birthday. So let’s bring it home with some good energy and stuff like that, man, and I’m really excited about talking to Kieran. I also would like to say before we get started that tonight Chinwag is being broadcast, telecast, whatever, I don’t know, live streamed side by side parallel, any word you can choose. If there’s better words than that, just send in the comments and stuff.

(01:48)
Hello, Nick May lovely to see your comments bud. Hello Dan with Aussie verse. So you’ll be able to watch Chinwag on Aussie verse. Now if you are watching Chinwag on Aussie verse and you’ve never seen Chinwag before, chinwag is a show, basically it’s a comic book talk show really just to give it to you just straight. And it’s based on six prompting words, questions, who, what, where, when, why, and how we tend to get to who. And then it just generally veers off into all manner of directions. I don’t think there’s been a show where we’ve got through the six questions. We’ve been too busy chin wagging, hence is the fluidity of Chinwag, hence is the enjoyment of it because we don’t know where it ever goes. So I do believe that’s everything. I really must make a mental note to myself to write down some notes instead of doing this all ad lib every couple of weeks. But all right, now Mr. Ki and Jack, I’m looking forward to this mate because you and I know of each other, but we have not had the privilege of, oh well I haven’t had the privilege of meeting. You might think I’m a total drunko by the end of this, but hey we dunno. So we’ll just have to find out and man, let’s rock and roll.

Kieran Jack (03:12):
Yeah, yeah, thanks for having me on the show again man. I, I’ve watched the show for ages so it is nice to actually be on here and to be able to talk to you for the first time. Yeah, like you said, I haven’t really crossed paths with you with the drink and draws and the whole comics thing that’s been going on for this last few years. So it’s been great to be able to come on tonight and jump on and talk to you. So yeah, I’m really excited.

Leigh Chalker (03:39):
Yeah, no, that’s good man. That’s good. I like it’s some good energy already in the green room and stuff like that. And we’ve got the energy candles are burning and I dunno what candles are burning in scissors house, but there’s something going on man. It’s a birthday, so rock and wrong. So man, we’ll just get straight into the who of it, but actually I’m going to have a cigarette and I’m going to let you control the narrative mate because this is part of the show. So

Kieran Jack (04:13):
Yeah,

Leigh Chalker (04:14):
Who

Kieran Jack (04:16):
Am I? What am I doing? What am I doing here? Yeah, I started back in the comics world probably about eight years ago now with a little podcast called The Halftime Effect, which kind of threw me in the deep end of this little industry that I was taking off in Australia. Been going for years, but I don’t know, I’d noticed it and I kind wanted to get involved and talk to those people and find out their worlds and that was how I kind of got involved with it all. And at that point I was like, why not doing this? I love comic books. I was reading the Classic Tales of Batman and Spider-Man and all that and I’d grown a bit tired of it wasn’t really for me anymore and I found myself thinking why do I write my own stories? So I kind of went to the drawing board and looked at my experience in the world and what can I talk about, what can I write about that, my own experiences that could be interpreted into a comic book.

(05:16)
And it’s funny, I was a baker for 10 years and I thought why not create a story about bread and the industry that I worked in and working early hours of the morning. There’s some weird stuff that goes on in the bakery, so could I interpret that into my own story? So I just threw myself in the deep end and just went for it and lo and behold, I had an audience there that were interested in reading my stories and it was so surreal. It was just, okay, this is happening. I’ve made a comic book and it’s out in the world and people enjoy it, so let’s make another one. And here we are eight years later and it’s grown into this amalgamation of, I think we’re at nearly 30 different releases in our series that we’ve got from Talking Bread right through to where we are today. So it’s pretty incredible to come from there and look back on it all when

Leigh Chalker (06:13):
Well, you’re a prolific little bugger, I’ll tell you that every time I look there’s always something new coming out from you, man. So it’s old when you started Apprentice young fellow, like 14 sort of thing or late teens?

Kieran Jack (06:30):
What was that? Sorry, when did I start? Did you say? Sorry.

(06:35)
No, it was 25. 25 when I started, oh sorry, baking. I started baking, yeah, about 14, 14 years. 14 years old. Did a school-based apprenticeship, they called it back then. I say back then it’s like early two thousands. But yeah, it was a school-based apprenticeship and then it would accumulate the time off your apprenticeship when you went into full-time after getting out of school. So I finished up school and then jumped into an apprenticeship and I think it was like a year and a half of the actual apprenticeship by the time I accumulated all that time whilst I was at school and whilst I was studying still at school. And then yeah, I basically jumped out, went my apprenticeship and then went into a bakery, came pretty close to getting my own bakery and it was awakening. It wasn’t really my thing and I’ve always loved art and graphic design and so I thought, screw it, I’m going to go and study graphic design at the age of 23, go back and study and learn that. Then once I graduated from graphic design degree, I basically put the final nail in the coffin for the baking and then walked away from it.

Leigh Chalker (07:43):
Yeah, yeah, obviously obviously the baking. Yeah, look, I suppose we’ve all had jobs we haven’t enjoyed as much as we possibly thought we’d have and sometimes you’ve got to just have a job because it pays the bills. I mean there’s nothing wrong with, but there. When you were that little fella in school and you were starting with your bacon, obviously you mentioned Batman, so there’s one I always loved learning the little influences and inclinations when you’re in your youth like the Stripe. So while you had your own money, I’m figuring it was big bucks back then, mate, five bucks an hour or something like that. Good evening. Thanks for watching. What did you think pulled the heartstrings man to when you went to the comic Bookshop?

Kieran Jack (08:50):
Yeah, it was funny. I grew up in a small town, so it was only what was limited to the news agents. So we had Phantom and there was Batman, so it was Batman and Detective Comics, action comics. And then there was, I think it was, I’m going to say it was Ultimate Spider-Man at the time. So it was very limited by what, of course there was Madman comics and sorry, mad Magazine and what was the 2000 ad? So those were the other ones as well. So it was very limited by what I could get my hands on. So whenever I would go to Melbourne or Sydney, I’d be kind of what can I get and get friends to pick up stuff for me if they can. So yeah, lots of Batman detective comics, lots of Phantom comics. It was just whatever I could get my hands on really. And you’re right, that small wage I was getting was going on comic books. I was getting as many as I could.

(09:48)
But yeah, look, there’s a few in the collection I’ve got now, I look back on ’em. I’ve got most of Jim Lee’s Hush Run and Jeff Loeb’s one. That’s got to be one of my favourites. I think it’s because of the nostalgia of the time that I was reading it at 2003, I think it was around that time. But stuff like that, detective comics, I was all over it and just whatever I could get my hands on, I’m pretty sure the news agents grew tired of me coming in every week going, what do you got next? What’s there now I do that to the comic book stores around Australia. What do you got? I want to read,

Leigh Chalker (10:20):
I’m looking over your left shoulder there, mate. I’m looking at your bookshelf. I’m thinking you might be in the market to get a second one there. I’m assuming

Kieran Jack (10:31):
It’s starting to get pretty scary. The amount of coins I’ve gone, oh, there’s probably a bit too many there, but

Leigh Chalker (10:37):
Yeah, they piled up on the floor yet tables and stuff,

Kieran Jack (10:42):
They’re getting close. No, not sitting on ’em yet. Yet the studio has become very crowded, especially when you’ve got your own stock to take care of as well. You’ve got to try and manage that as well.

Leigh Chalker (10:57):
Indeed, mate, I’m just going to interrupt you there for a second because Sean Keen and just set a comment that there’s a lot of hair on this show and Kieran and I were just talking about how our stylists have obviously worked very closely together over the years, mate. So bringing in a bit of more of a slip streamed chinwag this evening. I’m a little bit rough around the edges, but hey, this is just what happens actually, what’s funny man, actually getting on the hair. And this is the divergent people of Chinwag. So we’ll get back to what Kiran said. It’s all a circle, man. So how, yeah, you sent me that photo for the banner the other day, man, and I saw you last and you had hair and you looked like you, but you had with

Kieran Jack (11:53):
There. Yeah,

Leigh Chalker (11:54):
Damn it was there like, Hey, I did too, don’t feel bad. And then you sent me that photo and I was looking and I thought to myself, man, he looks, people aren’t get what’s going on here. It’s going to be like Kieran and Lee could do a mirror image of each other. So I thought I’d better chuck some growth here, see the difference. But then I realised I had tattoos, mate, so then I was thinking, Hey, we’ll be all right here anyway. People will tell the difference. You probably more articulate than I’m, so that’ll work well for you. Not at all. Getting back to a lot of people that I talk to, their influences when they’re young come from lots of different areas. Some people get into cartoons and movies when they’re young, an athlete, they strike a liking with the Batman movies, leads to comics, all parts, everyone’s got one now. You haven’t really mentioned anything like cartoons or movies at this stage. So you genuinely a young fella liked your comic books?

Kieran Jack (13:12):
Yeah, I’ve got my auntie to blame for this because she actually bought my first comic for me when I was a three-year-old and three year olds don’t exactly know what a comic book is at the time, but they know what Batman is. So it was, I’m going to stuff this up, but it was like Batman issue 6 34 or something. It was with Scarecrow and Batman. He had Scarecrow tied up with spiders crawling all over and Robin’s in the window. So it was my first comment, I’ve never forgotten it. And she bought it for me and I cherished it for a long time. And then being a 10-year-old probably lost it in a backpack or at school or something like that. But yeah, I had a fondness for comic books at a very early age. I remember getting a copy of the Batman 89 comic book, getting phantom comic books whenever there was a local show on.

(14:05)
I’d have the show Bagg full of the Phantom Comics sprawled out my room reading them clippings from newspapers, the old strips from the newspapers, whatever I could really get my hands onto. So comics have been a really big influence in my life before TV or film were really there. I’ve got a very fondness for both those formats of media, but comic books are where it’s really at for me. So yeah, I don’t know how many people get a comic book at three as 3-year-old, but it’s something that I consistently tell her about every time I see her. And we talk about the comics and how it’s all going. And I always say, it’s you that got me onto this path. Let me down this rabbit hole that I’m down now creating comic books. So yeah, that’s where it all started really with the comic book.

Leigh Chalker (14:55):
No, that’s interesting man. Yeah, no, I like it. Similar trajectory to me, mate. Very young here, have a comic book can attain yourself suddenly it’s like magic. And then dad comic book, just all man, I’ve never really, I don’t know. You do dabble in these things and this is my wing man, Kieran, he’s with me all the time. This is Lloyd say day to Lloyd, he’s my buddy. He’s always down here. He likes getting on camera more than I do mate. I probably see him three or four

Kieran Jack (15:31):
Times

Leigh Chalker (15:32):
Tell you what vain little bugger. But anyway, I wonder if he gets that from Yeah, man comics, I like that with the So Batman 89, so like 1989 sort of thing. So not so old. I mean it was in my lifetime that puts it around the norm Bra Fogle and Alan Grant sort era of Batman comic I would assume. Yeah, yeah,

Kieran Jack (16:08):
Yeah, that’s exactly it

Leigh Chalker (16:10):
Man. And Alan Grant stuff, because

Kieran Jack (16:13):
I’m going to try and see we can

Leigh Chalker (16:14):
Find Batman, dude, man, I love Nor Bra Fogle’s Batman. That to me when I saw that as a kid was like, oh man, I like that Batman. I wish someone would put that onto a movie that would blow my mind, man.

Kieran Jack (16:29):
It’s such a distinct style as well. Such a distinct style. You bang on the buck there when you come to who it was and who was writing and illustrating on those comics. Yeah, it’s funny. I actually had to trace them back and get them back in my collection for that reason. So I’ve got them behind me somewhere in here in this mess, bagged and boarded and I cherish them. I really do. They’re very special to me. I really do appreciate my auntie giving ’em to me as a young child and kind of hooking me on letting me down the path of being a comic book creator.

Leigh Chalker (17:08):
I think that’s beautiful. Would your auntie be watching tonight? Would you like to give auntie a shout out or maybe, I dunno,

Kieran Jack (17:17):
She should be. Yeah. Hey Amanda, if you’re watching, thank you for this and thank you for letting down the path of comic books and the madness that is as well.

Leigh Chalker (17:27):
Yeah, I like it, man. Look at him. He’s happy, he’s doing things that he wants to do. He’s out of that bakery. No more meringues for ki. It’s like see you later, man. I’m Gonski. So obviously I guess because you are very prolific man, and I don’t know how long the talking bread had been out for by that stage, but my first come across of you was when we did the comics calendar and we did an image, a cool image and weird how the world works man. And I remember looking at that image at the time and I remember thinking to myself, man, I’d like to talk to him about that. So I’m going to assume that we know you’re a baker. So I’m going to put two and two together here, man. And think that your pensions for bread and stuff might’ve led to this obviously. And Sean Keenan, here we go. Has he never baked anything and brought it to a show? I’m not sure he was ever a baker. There you go, man. There you go.

Kieran Jack (18:50):
He’s lighting Aiff F there because I made brownies the last super. He never even had one. I offered him one. Come on mate.

Leigh Chalker (19:01):
He’s in the heat at like 2:00 AM in the morning. This is where I want to diverge to we 2:00 AM starter. Where you one of those four little buggers to get in there like that sort of hour?

Kieran Jack (19:12):
Yeah, there was two. There was 12. 12 ams. There was 7:00 PM in Easter when you were doing multiple amounts of hot cross buns. You start at 7:00 PM while everyone’s still out and about. Have you ever

Leigh Chalker (19:26):
Eaten the black cross buns ever after you left the bakery? Man,

Kieran Jack (19:31):
I couldn’t eat ’em when I was there. I couldn’t load ’em. I’ve gradually gotten back into ’em, but it’s a struggle. Definitely a struggle. But look, it was a great career to have at the time, but I do not wish it upon anyone to be honest.

Leigh Chalker (19:54):
Man. I remember because the bakeries, this is what I feel for you man, being that poor young person in their bacon. The last thing you want to do Sunday morning, man, 2:00 AM 3:00 AM in the morning. And I was one of those drunk GOs because where we live in the city in Townsville, when the nightclubs and pubs were all in the city, man. And I used to live in North Ward. So to get home you’d go over a slight rise. Yeah man, two foot rise. You I’m dying here. You just had a night out on the TURPs man and Brumbies used to be open at this little precinct man at 3:00 AM in the morning. And man, I loved you guys at that stage, man, you bake as I thought you were the greatest people in the world. You could get Covid high at 3:00 AM in the morning and put up, there were heaps of people there too. Them were so pleasant. So as I’ll never get to see those people again. I’ll give you my sterling thanks mate for seeing the Bruce hangovers and that during those times, man and my mates, it was good days. Good times. Yeah. Gday mate, how are you? Sp lovely to see you mate. I hope you’re well. Now let’s get into the Talking Bread.

Kieran Jack (21:30):
Yeah, talking bread. Yeah, I kind of dove into that in the deep end. I never really, I wasn’t a writer. I wrote stories for school assignments. I’d watched a heap of movies, read a heap of comics. I’m like, why don’t I have a crack at this? So jumped in, did the talking bread. I’ve drawn my whole life. Drawn my whole life. Yeah. So I’ve always loved to draw, always wanted to do art. Something in the way of art when I was at school wasn’t all of opportunities for me. So that’s why it led down to baking career, which was still form of art, I guess you’d call it form of art, artisan creations, whatever you may call it. But yeah, so I was like, all right, I’m going to dive in again. I hadn’t really practised, kept practising up with my drawing. So I kind of dove in again with the deep end and just restarted training myself in that area.

(22:19)
And yeah, I just kind of brought it all together. I was like, this is how I’m going to do it. I didn’t have a script for the talking bread, I just went straight and started drawing the panels and coming back to it recently and remastering it. It was like, yeah, holy shit, I really needed to have a script for this. But it’s fun and it was energetic, so I think that’s what carried it more so it embodied a lot of the joyfulness that I had when I was baking and those characters that are there, they embodied a lot of the people that I may or may not work with. And that was the way I kind of jumped into it and

Leigh Chalker (22:57):
It had

Kieran Jack (22:58):
A great, are you

Leigh Chalker (22:58):
Friends with the hot cross bun man? That’s why you can’t mention anyone’s name, didn’t I? And who’s the guy? That’s the next one. Alright, so Richo someone who has a patisserie chef in the family. What is Kieran’s signature dish or his favourite dish?

Kieran Jack (23:22):
My signature dish,

Leigh Chalker (23:24):
That’s a question.

Kieran Jack (23:26):
I mean from a dinner point of view, it’s usually meatballs. I do a mad meatballs pasta from the baking side of it. It’s actually the Turkish Turkish loaf I do. And quite enjoy making Turkish bread. It’s pretty straightforward stuff. A bit of water, a bit of flour, pinch, a yeast pinch of salt, let it rest, punch it a couple of times, put some holes in it, throw it in the oven, bang, it’s done. It is a pretty straightforward kind of bread and it’s actually really tasty. But yeah, that’s probably my two signature dishes.

Leigh Chalker (24:02):
Yeah, right. There you go. Well I like that mate. If you’ve got any more questions for Kieran, hopefully by the end of the show we’ll have convinced him to put out his own cookbook and give us all a few tips. Turkey bread, good stuff, man. That’s cool. So with the no writing, look, I’ve been down this road, man I can sympathise with because I was the idiot that decided to come up with Battle for Bustle and had somewhat of a script, but then just veered off into any old thing and had to piece it together. And it was, anyway, that’s the time gone by and you learn and then you had the story in the mind from start to finish and you nutted it out and then you came back and you could do things like, oh, it doesn’t make sense, I’m going to have to redo that page, or cut the paste panels and stuff. And then it just, instead of being a nice smooth road man, it becomes a bit more of a back paddock sort like thing. Did you find that and did you swear to yourself that you’d never do it again?

Kieran Jack (25:24):
Yeah, I think it was, well yeah, I swore I’d never do it again without a script. That’s a story in itself.

Leigh Chalker (25:36):
We got time.

Kieran Jack (25:38):
I think that with the first one, I made it a very simplistic story being from, I moved to Melbourne when I completed my apprenticeship. So I’ve got a very big fondness for Melbourne. I love that city and I no longer live there, but I still enjoy going there. And I kind of use the city itself as the background for the Talking Bread. So big thing in the city is pigeons and you’d always see the pigeons of the bins scabbing away at the bags trying to get the day old bread. So they were basically the villains of this first story. It was like, well you’ve got that, you’ve got the bread slices.

(26:18)
And I just brought it all together and it’s funnily recently I’ve been thinking about with the Lady of the Swamp, my influence in horror and how I love horror movies and I kind of look back on the Talking Bread and it is very much Frankenstein when you really think about it. When you go from start to finish The Talking Bread, it’s these slices of bread that have been brought to life by the baker, which is very similar mirroring in Frankenstein’s story, Frankenstein’s Monster as well. So yeah, it was really interesting to kind of go back and look at that. And then when I came into the other issues, the talking, I was like, all right, now I need to actually figure out a script for it, sit down, write a script, and made it the six part series that it is today. And it was really fun. Issue two was a part of the 24 hour comic book challenge. I did that, I’ll never do that again. That sucks. I just did not enjoy that at all.

Leigh Chalker (27:19):
Did not

Kieran Jack (27:19):
Enjoy

Leigh Chalker (27:19):
That age in 24 hours. Little comic book like man.

Kieran Jack (27:25):
Yeah, it definitely showed when I went back and remastered it last year, it was definitely evident that it was done in 24 hours. But it was an interesting experience and by the end of it, you can really tell where my mind was going. It was really going down the rabbit hole and I don’t think I’ll ever do that again. It wasn’t enjoyable. And I’m all about enjoying the experience and enjoying the ride, but as comment creators, we like to challenge ourselves and do these crazy things. So it was like, well had a go at it, hated it and we’ll never do it again,

Leigh Chalker (28:06):
But it’s done now and you succeeded, man. So no one can take that away from you. And it’s, that’s job well done because from the tales that I’ve heard, it’s like I’m not ever going to have a go at it, man. I can’t even finish a comic book series in 30 years, man, let alone try and finish a comic book in 24 hours.

Kieran Jack (28:27):
It was brutal. It was brutal. I think I started it early morning and then when I’d gotten to the, I think it was about 2:00 AM my mind was just, I had too much coffee, I was delirious, I think I went and got some McDonald’s just to try and fill my stomach and keep me going. And I was wrecked by the morning and it wasn’t even making sense. I was lettering it and my editors just like, you need to go to sleep. It’s not making any sense. So that was basically, that was the end of it. Once they said that it was finished, but it was like there was bits and pieces I had to go back and change. But yeah, I was good. That was enough for me once it was enough.

Leigh Chalker (29:11):
Yeah. Oh that’s a beautiful moment in time, man. That’s right, Shane

Kieran Jack (29:15):
Over. I trust Shane to say that. Yeah,

Leigh Chalker (29:18):
Yeah. But that’s a beautiful moment in time, man. And no one can take that back from you. So that’s a lovely achievement, man. So congratulations on that. Well we got Sigma Studio. Hello SK Yo Lee, yo ki and happy birthday Shane. I know you’re hiding behind the scenes. He certainly is sk and nice to hear from you, mate, I haven’t seen you in while and you’re both wearing very similar glass frame. Was that intentional Sk mate, if you just drop back into the show 29 minutes ago, which you can read, watch anytime you like, we’ve basically decided that we’re sacking our stylists mate and this is it. And Kieran gets to look at the mirror of what he can look like when this is what a good life does to you, mate. But anyway, hey, anyway, I digress. So six issues with the Walking Breath. Now, I suppose this is a question that comes up often. The title Play on the Walking Dead,

Kieran Jack (30:31):
It was never my intention. I love, as you can see, probably behind you, I’ve got the Walking Dead there, love the Walking Dead, but it was never an intention 2015 was created in, I love The Walking Dead, but it was like, oh, they’re talking pieces of bread, talking Bread makes sense. And I think that’s a great title. And I had to pitch it to a mate who was interested in what I was doing and I said, oh, talking Bread. He’s like, oh, you’re just doing a parody of the Walking Dead. And I was like, never even thought of that. And I’m like, oh, do I change it? And he’s like, no. He goes, keep that. That’s your title. That’s what you want to call. They are talking Bread. So there was no real influence in that title being affiliated with the Walking Dead at all.

(31:15)
And what I love now is that at conventions when I’ve got the Talking Bread banner up in the booth or at the table, people will walk by and they’ll see the Talking Bread, but they’ll actually say like The Walking Dead. And it’s kind of a great way of just luring ’em in and it’s a false sense of like, Hey, come check out the book. And they read it and they laugh and 80% of the time I’ll get a sale out of it because I’ve been able to attract them that way. So it’s really interesting to see that happen. It was a great mistake. Really.

Leigh Chalker (31:52):
Yeah, yeah. Well I mean mate, it’s all about getting yourself out there. I just always, I wondered that because at the time I’d sort of missed the Walking Dead, the TV show, that whole thing. And I dunno, I decided to binge watch 77 seasons of it. Yeah,

Kieran Jack (32:15):
Wow.

Leigh Chalker (32:17):
However many there are. It was a lot went away on me. I don’t know, in one of those delirious moments I had that, I wonder if Kieran ever named The Talking Bread after the Walking Dead. Maybe one day I’ll ask him that. And I did see how these

Kieran Jack (32:36):
Things happen. It all comes around, all comes around full circle.

Leigh Chalker (32:39):
I know. Like a donut. Oh, but anyway,

Kieran Jack (32:43):
Yes, I made donuts, I made enough donuts in my life

Leigh Chalker (32:50):
Making thing, man, I’ll stop now.

Kieran Jack (32:52):
Alright,

Leigh Chalker (32:53):
I’ll

Kieran Jack (32:53):
No, no, look, ask away. It was definitely, it was an interesting career to have and I don’t regret it at all. I learned a lot out of it. I got a business degree out of it, which has helped immensely with the comic book thing. But it’s really interesting.

Leigh Chalker (33:14):
That has helped you with halftime production,

Kieran Jack (33:17):
Correct? It has, yes, yes. And other endeavours. So it’s been a real kind of, it’s not a bad thing at all. I think I always take it with pride that I had a good job and I was good at what I did and was able to get a couple of bonuses out of it. At the end of the day, I got a business degree, met some good people, met some interesting characters that made for an interesting comic book.

Leigh Chalker (33:45):
That’s all that matters. I mean, when you think about it, I mean you get your start in the funniest places and the Talking Bread and being a Baker got your business degree led you to Half tone productions, which is very successful because you are absolutely pumping out stuff like there’s no tomorrow. Thank you. Thank you as we’ll get into, and I also, you’re pretty, oh man, you’re very, how shall I say, present at the conventions and stuff like that. I remember back in the early days and stuff too, early days, a few years back, we were also very forthcoming with people. And what’s wonderful is that a lot of creators are, which I think is great for people that haven’t been to conventions or new people, but you’re very forthcoming with, I should have tried this or I should have done that. I should have been better this way.

(34:41)
I might get some more banners, that sort of a thing. And I liked that, that you were so open with that sort of a thing man, and very giving with your information and helping others that come after you and stuff with what you were doing at the time. So I’ve always admired that really about yourself and the other creators out there and certainly hope that you guys continue to do that because it is interesting because you never know when you’re going to need a certain thing or something might not work or a refresh your stock or that sort of stuff because there’s lots, so many things to think about, man, as I can tell by that. Yeah,

Kieran Jack (35:25):
Yeah. There’s a lot

Leigh Chalker (35:30):
Going to a convention, you got to get prepped, you got to pack the car, you got to get the thing. What I like to sort of get across to people that listen to Chin Wags or watch them and stuff is creators at the end of the day, it’s a huge symbi circle, whether you’re fans or people that buy the comic books or commissions editors, publishers like convention organisers. I mean it all works together. And I love the fact that it’s a very healthy community. It’s industrious as a great mate of mine would say, which would lead to industry people outside of it of the creating in those little areas that I’m talking about, don’t really understand the work and that all the little bits and pieces that go into getting that final thing in front of people. And I love the fact that we’ve already been able to talk about these sorts of things for you to get to your comic book and stuff now on a really strange, I guess query when you’ve gone to a convention, you’d have your utility belt of stuff that you’re taking, you’re not missing out. What was the one thing at the one time, because I’m willing to bet there would’ve been one, there might’ve been more, you can elaborate on this if you wish, but what’s the one thing that you got to that comic book convention you went, oh man, I really needed that. Why didn’t I think about that? There have to be something, isn’t there?

Kieran Jack (37:32):
God, there’s been a few times like that. I’m just trying to pick, which has been the absolute brick in the stomach. I’m just trying to think. There’s been a few times I’ve gotten to it and I’m like, I wish I had that here and I’ve missed it or I’ve forgotten it or it’s happened a few times and I try not to think about it too much. I try to push forward, but when it does happen, I get myself into a bit of a rut. I’m like, oh, why did I do that? Why did I do that? Fall you fall, you’ve got to kind of bounce back as quickly because you don’t have the time to stress out about those kind of things. And I’ve always tried to focus on the day itself, the cons. And as you know, they’re not easy. They’re definitely not easy. They’re up on your feet for most of it. You’re there churning away, talking to people, trying to make sales, trying to make the connection for people to pick up your book and at least have a look at it. Not exactly make a sale, but at least have that interaction with people.

(38:35)
So that’s always the hard part. I don’t think it’s been dire at times when I’ve missed something or I wish I’d had something that I don’t have with me or seen something. I always tried to think about what comes next, what am I doing that can make it better for me and a better experience for the people that come to the table. So that’s where I kind of like to go with. I don’t try to dote on anything I have missed or can I do that and can I do it better is how I try to think about it. And it’s always worked for me. It’s always played to my advantage, being able to keep evolving the table or the way I come across to people or the convention itself. But that’s basically where it’s kind of just continuing to grow from there and kept building up.

(39:26)
I haven’t really had to really stress about that. And I try to keep myself out of that mindset because you go down that mindset, it becomes a real dark place at a convention when you’re there to enjoy yourself and to obviously make a bit of money as well and have a good time and catch up with your comic mates and yeah, it’s really something I try not to do too much. I mean, on another note, I did hit a kangaroo recently when I was going to the Geek markets in Canberra at five o’clock in the morning, which did smash my car up a little bit. So that kind of was a bit of a downer for the moment on my way to a convention. And thankfully I was invited to go to that one. So there was no table costs for me, but it was still had to make the money to pay for the excess to get the car fixed now, which is, that happens, those kind of things happen. So I was disappointed I hit a poor kangaroo.

Leigh Chalker (40:23):
Yeah, yeah. Hey Jackie, how you going? Kieran? Jack is an awesome guy. Hey

Kieran Jack (40:31):
Dude.

Leigh Chalker (40:32):
Thanks buddy. Thank you, Jackie. Thank you very much and thank you for watching Now if I do miss any comments tonight, thank you everyone for watching the show as always. And I will endeavour to get the questions to Kira and keep an eye out on things, but sometimes we just get really involved in this stuff. It happens. Where are you living now that you are so close to Canberra that you can drive?

Kieran Jack (41:00):
I live in Aubrey Wodonga, so border of Vic and New South Wales. Yeah,

Leigh Chalker (41:04):
Yeah, yeah, right. Okay, that’s cool. Yeah, I’d love to go to a convention in Canberra because my dad’s side of the family are from Gunda guy.

Kieran Jack (41:14):
Oh wow. Yeah,

Leigh Chalker (41:16):
I spent quite a lot of time down there. I like that area of the world.

Kieran Jack (41:18):
Well, that’s exactly where I hit the kangaroo. I was gun guy,

Leigh Chalker (41:27):
Memories of gun.

Kieran Jack (41:33):
It was apparently a bad weekend for it, so there was a lot of carnage on the roads.

Leigh Chalker (41:38):
Yeah, right. I wonder what made it so different from any other, and whereabouts near Gaga did you run into? Said Ru,

Kieran Jack (41:46):
Just on the outskirts of it, going towards Canberra over the main bridge, just come off the bridge and going up the hill. I was coming down, I had the music that loud that when it hit, it hit scared the life out of me, but I’ve never hit a room before, so it was a completely new experience for me. And being five o’clock in the morning in Pitch Black, just even it was the icing on the cake for me. Really? Yeah. So yeah, I’m probably not going to be driving at nighttime anymore like that the early mornings anymore. So yeah, that was probably the worst experience I’ve had going to a convention after eight years, so I can’t complain.

Leigh Chalker (42:31):
Well, there’s something that people can keep in mind. Like early morning travel does sort of tend to lead to kangaroos. It happens. It happens up here too, mate. And sometimes you find them on your front yard, you know what I mean? Looking at you front,

Kieran Jack (42:52):
You don’t cross them.

Leigh Chalker (42:55):
Luckily enough around my area and in suburbs nearby, there’s just little wallabies and stuff, man, I wouldn’t really want to run into a kangaroo either. You can stay over there buddy. You distance like sheep Don’t get me far a sheep, man. I’ve got a thing about sheep, a childhood thing, very pretty from a distance and stuff and they sound very sweet, you know what I mean? Laid up on the not close and they’re all dangle, buried up and dirty and shit, and they’re all like, but anyway, I’ve digressed again, hence the Chinwag. So after you’ve done the Talking Bread, was that, obviously it wasn’t, but were you thinking to yourself at the time? Yeah, that’s it. I’ve done my comic book thing, you know what I mean? Or was the fires were burning, then you’d done a couple of conventions, people, you meeting people, you got your business degree, half tones start getting fanned here.

Kieran Jack (44:05):
Yeah, it was my mates Bradley who did super RBA at the time when I was wrapping up the Talking Bread, he had his artist walk away from the series, so he was kind of in limbo what he wanted to do. And I said, well, why don’t you come with me and bring it onto the half tone and I’m doing all the conventions I can take with me and have it on the table and do a bit of a soft reboot. We’ll get a new artist and come on and we’ll go from there. And so we got an artist on. I was kind of in the background working on my next book in purgatory and I was kind of, let’s get this out. So we pushed that one out and we got Super RBA back on the Road again, which was great. And then I was like, by the time I’d finished talking Brett, I already started basically outlining how imp purgatory was going to play out. I had a couple of ideas also, but I was like, no, I want to do purgatory. I need to tell the story.

(45:06)
I grew up as a Catholic, so I was kind of wanting to tell the story and I left. I denounced that at an early age after I decided to walk away from that. And yeah, it really is a real personal thing for me when it comes to purgatory and it tells my own affliction towards religion and the world we live in. And I went deep into that and the response from that was incredible. It was probably more well received than what the Talking Bread was. I mean, it had a skull on it and you put a skull on the front of a comic book and people are going to eat it up, but it was the Grim Reaper. So it was really, I was telling a point of view from the Grim Reaper’s perspective about life after death, religion, how do we deal with that and war, all that kind of stuff.

(45:53)
And I kind of emulated that through that and it was kind of cathartic for me to be writing about this. And this is where I started to take my writing a little bit more serious as well as a creator, I was like, okay, I need to really make sure that I’m really projecting about what I want to talk about. So Purgatory being kind of the sophomore for Half Tone productions really, it was really about me kind of honing in on the writing side of it and creating this character in this world that it kind of builds out on the mythology of the Bible and religion, and it doesn’t have to be just Catholic. It was really looking at all kinds of religion and how it’s perceived in the world that we live in. And still to today. It’s been so well received. The series is still ongoing. I’ve had it on hiatus for about nearly three years now whilst I’ve been working on other projects because I just needed a bit of a break from it. It can get heavy

Leigh Chalker (46:47):
From where you’re talking. Yeah, content can get heavy.

Kieran Jack (46:51):
Yes, yes, absolutely. It can get heavy. And I did throw myself into it pretty much. Once the talking better finished, I had no other projects really lined up. Super RBA was out the door and that was going really well. So I just threw myself into this project and I think for the first year and a half I pumped out six issues. So it was quite intensive in that sense. So that’s why I just like, I need to just put the brakes on and focus on a couple of other stories to have a bit of a breather. And I’ve recently come back into it and I’ve got two issues now waiting to go and it’s so great to be back in that world and kind of creating those characters again and working on the stories and playing in that sandbox again because I’ve been away for so long. So that,

Leigh Chalker (47:36):
Sorry to interrupt, but to get six and a half issues, you just said six, well, 6, 4, 6

Kieran Jack (47:42):
Issues

Leigh Chalker (47:43):
In 18 months.

Kieran Jack (47:46):
18 months, yeah.

Leigh Chalker (47:47):
That’s a lot of work, man. You must have had some stuff in you that needed to come out with that comic book. You must have had hit a point of a sense of urgency that I want to tell this story.

Kieran Jack (48:03):
Yeah, I really did it and it was, that’s part of the reason it was so well received, the response we had from the Kickstarter campaigns and the conventions. It’s outsold the talking bread, but it’s also just been so well received to the point now that people are message me and say, Hey, when’s the next one coming out? You’ve left us in limbo for two or three years, is there another one coming out? And I’m well and truly on the way to making the next six issues. But yeah, it was really cathartic for me to write that series and kind of get that off my chest. And a lot of people have come back to me since then and said, we really get where you are coming from when you are talking in this story, which really hits home more than anything, Ken as a writer, to have people come up and say, Hey, we understand where you’re coming from. We’ve been in that similar situation. So it was really good. It was really refreshing. It was great to be able to put it out into the world and have it received so well. And look, all I can say is I’m really looking forward to getting the next six issues out. We’ve got two already finished and yeah, I’m really looking forward to seeing what people think of this next part of the story.

Leigh Chalker (49:22):
Yeah, no, that’s fantastic. I can tell by the passion and just the way you described your experience in getting it out then that it’s obviously a passion project for you. Yeah,

(49:33)
I also would like to say that I had self autobiographical work is respect to You, man, because to me that’s ballsy, but you know what I mean, you’re throwing yourself out there. And to me, what a marvellous thing. Comics are the medium in itself where you can do that. And if the reader is savvy enough, they’ll know exactly this man, this dude’s given himself here. You know what I mean? And if you’re not, you can still enjoy it, you know what I mean? For the fine piece of work it is. So piece, that’s the beautiful relationship between the creator and the person reading it. Man, that’s fantastic mate. I have seen in purgatory around, I haven’t read it, but seen that fire just then. It is definitely going to track that down in the very near future, man. Yeah,

Kieran Jack (50:43):
Definitely, man.

Leigh Chalker (50:45):
No, it’d be great man to get a look at that. So I’ll hit you up afterwards where I can find that. Yeah, cheers, man. You had a break. You had a little bit of a break because I can end with that because just so, so you know, I’m not pulling your leg. Battle for Bustle is a very personal, intimate, I guess story for me too that is semi biographical. It’s just I’ve chosen science fiction world too, talk about my relationships with dad and my views on the world and nature and technology and things like that and how I see things in creative way. And it does get heavy, man.

Kieran Jack (51:40):
It really does.

Leigh Chalker (51:40):
To a point where I can’t draw it anymore. I don’t want to go back there. I just need a break. I totally get that because Battle for me has been on hiatus for about 18 months. Well, I’ve been doing some other stuff too, man, because yeah, yeah, you need

Kieran Jack (51:57):
It, you need it.

Leigh Chalker (51:59):
Oh mate. Yeah, I know, I know. So I understand now. And I’m very empathic towards that too, mate. So Kieran, I like it, man. I like your fire brother. It’s good. It’s good. It’s a good thing now we’ve had that. You’ve got people they want more. Just don’t get to it when I’m ready. This is the other advantage of being an independent creator, you know what I mean? You don’t have people cracking that whip that you’ve got to get it out on date, on time, all that sort of job. You can still enjoy a little bit of life, still enjoy some balance, mate, which is an integral thing because a lot of us would, Hey Bo, how you going buddy? And it’s the first time on Aussie verse, mate, I mentioned you at the show, at the start of the show, and thank you very much, Bo, you’re a champion and everyone involved at Aussie verse, everyone that is in part of the Aussie verse watching the Aussie verse Love you and much love. That’s what makes the world go around. Where were we before that Kieran helper brother out? I’ve lost my train of thought.

Kieran Jack (53:16):
We’re talking about the amount of work we put into these comics and how we’re not buying to people’s schedules.

Leigh Chalker (53:23):
Yes, that’s correct. And yeah, because man, I totally lost my train of thought. That’s okay. We’ll probably come back to it. I work like that, my brain veers off and then probably by the end of the show I’ll come back and tack onto it. But yeah, the work schedule is, oh, that’s where I was going, Steve, this is, anyway, there you go.

Kieran Jack (53:43):
You got it.

Leigh Chalker (53:45):
I know, mate. I know my brain works weird, man. Sometimes it’s like four feet in front of where my face is. I can’t help that. I get excited. Hear you

Kieran Jack (53:56):
Man. I hear you.

Leigh Chalker (53:59):
It’s excitement’s good. So we get to the point of we’re introverts really. I mean when you write and you’re drawing, you’re introverted and you’re not really sure what the world’s going to think of what you’re doing. You know what I mean? Pretty sure about what you are doing and you’re hoping that things resonate with other people. So part of in that world you are creating is the heaviness. And it’s lovely to get some positive responses meant Absolutely. But the one thing I’ll say about your stuff that I’ve heard from other people in the community is it’s all got positive stuff, mate. Coming from it. I’ve not heard a bad word about any of your words. Thank

Kieran Jack (54:44):
You. Thank you. So

Leigh Chalker (54:46):
That’s one positive for you. I mean, I don’t know that many people man. Do you know what I mean? When they speak of ki and Jack, they’re giving him a big thumbs up, man.

Kieran Jack (54:56):
Cheers. Yeah,

Leigh Chalker (54:58):
Yeah, yeah. So you keep going. So we’ve got, and then now your next one was, I’m going to have a punt here man, because you’re that, let’s see how this all go for. It works. We’ve already, I’ve got a little bit of it. I dunno what it’s like, but the apparition, am I close?

Kieran Jack (55:24):
You got it. Bang on there.

Leigh Chalker (55:28):
Alright.

Kieran Jack (55:29):
Yeah, you hit the nail on the head. All the apparition

Leigh Chalker (55:34):
Hit me with that. Where’s this? After the success of imp purgatory, people are digging it. You’re getting as much stuff now at your conventions. You haven’t hit any kangaroos. Things are rolling. Rolling. Where are we at with the apparition and what was the gestation of that?

Kieran Jack (55:57):
Well, it was coming out, it came out of a couple of things. It came out of, again, I was tired of the superhero tropes of the comics. I’d just gotten board with it and I wanted to tell a story. I wanted to do a parody, I’d always want to do a parody of a character. And we were living in the world of the pandemic and lockdowns and all that jazz. And I was like, you know what? Just need something a bit more brighter than purgatory. So I came off that and I basically started writing it straight away and I wrote 120 page story that included, I think it was 12, 13 chapters within it, within the 120 pages, passed it off to a couple of people within the industry and got some feedback, some of it positive, some of it negative. One of the comments was that it was a bit nasty at points.

(56:56)
Others that was pretty hilarious and they could see where I was coming from, which was great, great feedback. I took it all on board and reworked the script a little bit, which was great for my ability as a writer to test myself and push myself a little bit more with some feedback from my peers, which I always do appreciate and respect the apparition. I kind of went in head first with that one. And as you might see on the covers, it’s definitely a par of a certain superhero that I won’t name for legal reasons, but the response I thought, look, imp purgatory is the benchmark of where I’m at. And I said, I don’t think we can go any higher than that. And I was wrong. Apparition was very well received. We managed to sell a few copies, which was great. I’m always appreciative it was selling a few copies, but we sold a few more than we thought we were going to.

(57:59)
I got in with what I wanted to say and got out as quickly as I could because again, I didn’t want to get pursued, but I knew going into that project, I did a bit of research on the law around parody and what you can and can’t do. So the Australian arts law, I reached out to them and had a chat to them about what I was doing and where I was going with it. They gave me some feedback on what I can and can’t do, which was new territory for me. I’d never really bothered to research what I can and can’t say within a form of media,

Leigh Chalker (58:34):
Just for topic’s sake really, because it’s never been covered. And your Amanda talked to about this now, parody and imitation. Is that what the two

Kieran Jack (58:53):
Separate homage Ho homage. Yeah, homage.

Leigh Chalker (58:56):
What are the differences between those in what you researched and studied?

Kieran Jack (59:01):
So homage, it’s almost a love letter to a story or a character that imitates the story. And with a parody, you are taking the tropes of that character and you are making fun of it. So think of things like Rick and Morty, which is a very good example of parody. And I know in the early days when they created that cartoon, they were in a lot of trouble with Universal because they were parroting back to the future. And so you had to be really careful. I know Australia is a bit more tied to with their legislation when it comes to parody. You actually can get away with a bit more in Australia, but they’ve really got it down tooth and nail about what you can and can’t do. Whereas in America it’s really not. You’ve got a certain amount you can go before you get in trouble. Basically, if you start shitting on the character itself without naming it, you can get a season to assist little male saying, stop doing that, or we’ll take you to court.

(01:00:02)
So yeah, it was about knowing how far I could go without getting into trouble and finding myself in court as an independent creator and kind of pushing that to the boundaries. And I think I achieved that within the story I’m telling. It was two, we did two volumes of it and the audience surrounding that character that I’m parroting has welcomed it so well. I didn’t think it was going to be received well. And the response I’ve had from those people has been astounding. So I can walk away from that project saying, job done. I’m still selling copies. I have ’em at conventions. People walk up and say that character’s name. We have a chuckle about it.

(01:00:51)
Yeah, it was great to do. It was a real palate cleanser as well, coming off in purgatory, being a bit more darker and without giving spoilers away, I ended the story without being something I can never go back to. So I don’t really want to go back there. I’ve done what I wanted to do. I’ve said what I wanted to say and I’ve walked away from it, but I still sell it. I’ve got a little action figure behind me of him. It was fun to do. It was definitely different and it led to me being basically taking another project off, another indie creator and running with it, which

Leigh Chalker (01:01:33):
It

Kieran Jack (01:01:33):
Was a great opportunity. Yes. So that’s

Leigh Chalker (01:01:38):
Coming up shortly now. Another question that I’m most interested in with the parody in the Homash thing and just with your creative process during this, were you, the ideas, gestated,

(01:01:56)
You want to do this, you come off something heavy, you want to do something a bit, for lack of a better word, and no disrespect, I guess a little bit more loose, a little bit silly. I want to do something a bit crazy, man, serious, where you’re already scripted and then went to the people to say, Hey, this is what I’m thinking. Am I pushing too far? And did they say yes in this area you are, reel it back in. Did they do that for you or did you already have the comic book done and then send it off and then go,

Kieran Jack (01:02:39):
I’m going to lie. I was very nervous about putting it out. So I thought, oh, am I going to burn bridges by doing this potential bridges in the future? But I thought to myself, no, if you don’t have a stab at it, then someone else will have a goal at it. And I’d done my research and I knew my boundaries, and then I wrote it. I gave it to a couple of people. I had some feedback. It was a bit too nasty. It was a bit too heavy on certain areas where you’re taking the mickey out of the character. And it was great because one of them, one of the guys called me and had a chat and he’s just like, I love it. But he goes, you just need to probably tone it back a little bit because it’s probably a bit too on the nose for what you are going for.

(01:03:25)
And looking back in hindsight, he’s absolutely right. It probably was a little bit too heavy because it always probably would’ve been out of place within the story for being a lighthearted, humorous story about this character that we all know about. And yeah, it was good. I’m glad I did have that feedback before I went in because it helped me kind of curate how it would all play out towards the end of the story as well. So that was great. I really do appreciate it. And that’s something I actually do quite often now with my scripts. I’ll give it to a few people that are peers of mine and they’ll have a review of it and they’ll give me any feedback, which really always helps. I’m always appreciative of anyone that’s willing to give me feedback who’s got a little bit more experience or more experience than I do.

Leigh Chalker (01:04:14):
Yeah, yeah. Well, that’s how we learn, mate. You have your trusted people, mate. I’ve got mine.

Kieran Jack (01:04:22):
Exactly. Yeah.

Leigh Chalker (01:04:24):
Dropping ideas through, and they certainly get pushed through to Sea Sieve. I mean some like, oh, I really wanted that to work. When you get sort of like, I mean, these are all helpful things, mate. So at this stage, click a little recap for people. We’ve had the tall thread, six issues. We’ve had imp purgatory, six issues, so 12 issues all up. We’ve had the apparition two volumes, two like

Kieran Jack (01:05:01):
60, 60 and 70,

Leigh Chalker (01:05:04):
60 and 70. So you’ve pumped out essentially what, 300 odd pages of artwork and comic book in four or five years at this stage?

Kieran Jack (01:05:18):
Yeah. Yep. Yeah, about that.

Leigh Chalker (01:05:21):
Yeah. Right. Okay, man, we’re a beast. It’s like, my God, it’s like, wow, respect.

Kieran Jack (01:05:29):
Thanks,

Leigh Chalker (01:05:29):
Man. No, truly. You saw how slow I work, my God, man. Snails won’t go faster than me. But anyway, now you’ve got to that. How long did it take you to do the apparition to start to finish?

Kieran Jack (01:05:47):
It started in 2021, finished it in start of 2022. So a year. Worked on it for a year.

Leigh Chalker (01:06:00):
Okay. So essentially that’s only two years ago, and we’ve still got more projects in between the two years that you’ve done. And you are doing okay, man,

Kieran Jack (01:06:18):
It’s a marathon, isn’t it?

Leigh Chalker (01:06:20):
That aircom down man. Like hell. Anyway. Wow. That’s very impressive to me.

Kieran Jack (01:06:28):
Oh, thank you, man.

Leigh Chalker (01:06:30):
Yeah, no, absolutely, man. I

Kieran Jack (01:06:32):
Don’t have a social life. I don’t have a social life.

Leigh Chalker (01:06:35):
Yeah, yeah, no. Going

Kieran Jack (01:06:37):
Down the toilet.

Leigh Chalker (01:06:38):
Oh, well, look at the good stuff that you’re doing, man, and the people you meet and the joy you bringing to people. You know what I mean? And all the people you’re getting to meet, you know what I mean? And if it hadn’t have been for Auntie Amanda, none of it would have happened. I don’t even know the lady, but I love her, man. Social life is overrated, Shane. I hundred percent agree. Now you’re coming off the apparition, you’re humming, you’re feeling good. You got that out. So you covered the talking bread, which was semi autobiographical, you know what I mean? Dabbling in comic books. You’ve gone in purgatory, which is personal in your face. This is, here’s my soul book, this is my vision of the world heavy stuff. I want to get into some silly stuff. Bang next on the roster, mate. All right. Now, before you get to that, are you already coming up with ideas while you’re working on these other creations, or are you just solely bought?

Kieran Jack (01:07:52):
Yeah, no, I was working on other creations whilst I was mingling with all these other things. We had the rise of the Talking Bread come out, which was a little spinoff series of just little short stories that take place within the main universe. And that basically was, I did a pitch for, we had 12 different creators in Australia go to it, and they basically did different little short stories that take place within the universe that was released back in 2019. So that was done whilst I was working on purgatory.

Leigh Chalker (01:08:25):
So you’re also, at the same time as you are writing, working and drawing on your own stuff and half tones going, so you are promoting marketing, you’re editing, a lot of work goes into this, that sort of stuff because it’s a business. It’s not just a Saturday afternoon beers and I’m going to draw some stuff. You know what I mean? You’re serious about it, which is good stuff because this sort of thing’s motivating for a lot of other people out there too, man. Because the beauty of what I like about the opportunity that I get to talk people like you about with Chinwag is that there’s other people, I mean, Australia’s a big country, and there’s other people that in small towns you are like I am, that sometimes feel blown and wonder what they’re doing. But these sorts of chats allow people to see like, wow, man, this dude is really humming. You know what I mean? And pumping stuff out, motivated, it’s good. It’s very good.

(01:09:28)
And Auntie Amanda, it’s all your fault. So you’re also, obviously you didn’t do the artwork, you said 12 artists. So not only are you working on this comic book, you’re also organising other artists and doing scripts for them. You’re getting artwork in to be able to put all of these stories together. Now, the next thing that people sort of don’t understand if they don’t do comic books is you’ve got to also format these pages and stuff like that. And like you got to a letter ’em, if you’re not hand lettering them and you’ve got to get ’em ready for the printer. And then there’s that side of things too. So you are handling all of this by yourself while having this massive output of work. Is this correct?

Kieran Jack (01:10:20):
That’s correct. Yeah, very much so. It’s

Leigh Chalker (01:10:24):
Unbelievable.

Kieran Jack (01:10:26):
With the Rise Talking Bread, it was six writers, six artists, and I brought the teams together based off what I knew from them and how I know they work. And I matched ’em up. I said, oh, you’re going to work this one, you’re going to work this one. I put them together and then I basically linked them up and said, Hey, look, this is who you’re going to be working with. Get to know each other, work together on it. And basically from there they went nuts. And it was great for me as a creator, I was working on in Purgatory while this was all going on, but for me to receive the artwork and receive the stories and to see my creations being interpreted by other people, that was such a gift in itself. I was like, I’m paying these people to work on my project and to be able to receive something in return for what I’m paying for. It was incredible. I am an artist and I’m a writer, but I’m also, I’m producing work now. And to be able to see people create my stories and bring them to life is also much more fulfilling than probably what I’m doing with my own staff. I get to see that vision come to life in other ways from other people.

Leigh Chalker (01:11:43):
Have you ever had the sensation of, you have your vision and you let people come into that world, and there’s obviously some nervousness with that because you’re giving a little bit of yourself away there. You’re making yourself vulnerable with your baby, really the things you’re creating. And you ever had that moment where you’ve seen something come back and it has quite honestly blown your mind with how that particular artist has interpreted a page that you’ve written? Have you ever had that moment? I wouldn’t have every time that way. Why? God, just the

Kieran Jack (01:12:38):
Every time. Every time. So funnily enough, IMP Purgatory has a guest artist in each issue. So each issue we have someone come on and write a flashback that goes on within the story. So I’ve had Matt K, I’ve had Angie Spice, I’ve had Logan French Camil on there. So these people have come on and done that, and every time it just blows my mind more so now, because working with Logan with the Latest Swamp, which we’ll get to eventually, but at the moment he’s sending the pages through that I’m writing purely writing that project. But it’s phenomenal to see his vision on the story that I’m telling because his art still my art so completely different. So yes, you are a hundred percent right there, Lee. It’s just it blows my mind every time.

Leigh Chalker (01:13:26):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh man, it certainly would, man. You’re just having so much fun. I can see it. It’s good. Alright, so we’re going to move into your, one of the gentlemen, the fellow creators that I know you’ve had a lot to do with. I’ve seen it just in other interviews I’ve watched with you and things like that. And I’ve seen the comic book and stuff, and I’m aware that Matt k is out and about and I’ve met Matt once on a Friday night drink and draw long, long ago, and a very nice man. What’s the story with, because he’s a very busy man, I would suggest, from what I can see and understand, I mean, I dunno, the dude, you know him, but he seems busy. He’s busy. Yeah, yeah. His character that you came to next, how did that all come about, mate? Was that just one of those trusting relationships, you’d worked together enough, you’re on a resonate with each other and it’s like have a shot mate?

Kieran Jack (01:14:44):
It was just a friendship that built up from conventions. I tabled two tables down from it at a, I’m going to say I think it might’ve been Oz, and we just got to know each other through. Then he bought the talking. Brett, I bought his comic at the time and we kind of just grew from there, messaged every now and again on social media. And then we started connecting that way and it kind of flourished. And I had him do a bit of a cameo page within Purgatory and he smashed it out of the park. And then we did a launch for it. We did an exclusive at DE’s Comics. He had had a variant cover for that, which was huge. He made the trek up there from Melbourne and then as it just kept growing, growing. And then he was one of the people I gave the apparition to review and he gave me some feedback on that and he really enjoyed it. And the wrath, the curse, excuse me. He wrote The Wrath, the Curse back in 20, I say 2018, and he’d finished it. He’d completed the story and he moved on from it. And now he’s writing for Phantom. He does a lot of phantom stories at the moment for fruit. And he basically just gave me a call one day and he’s like, Hey man, I’ve had this really, really weird idea. Would you be interested in taking over the wrath of the Curse? I know the story is concluded.

(01:16:08)
I did a variant comic on one of his, which was actually the first of its kind for issue three. I did my own version of his story, even though he’d already illustrated his own, he gave me the chance to do a variant comic, which we don’t think it’s ever been done. We tried to research, it’s never been done. It’s no longer available. I’m glad for that. It’s actually horrendous when I’ll look at it. But yeah, I did that. And then he came back to me and said, would you be interested in taking the reigns and continuing the wrath, the curse story? I don’t really have any plans for it, but I want to see it taken out with other people. And they developed the story and Sarah, it goes. So I was like, yeah, sure. I was like, why not? It’s incredible honour. Thank you for letting me be part of this and do that.

(01:16:58)
So I wrote an outline for it, sent it off to him, he approved it, and then I dove straight in and started writing the story. I wrote it as a three part series originally, and then I thought, no, I’m going to turn into a graphic novel. Basically I wanted to get a one and done hit story so that the people who follow his work would be interested in picking it up and reading it. And it was also a business idea too. I was like, I’ll do a graphic novel then I’m not stuck with it, working on it for the next three to five years, kind of pumping out more and more and more. So yeah, he approved it, he loved it. The best feedback for me was that he’s like, I wrote it and I was like, holy shit, dude. That’s the best feedback I can hear. I was chuffed by that. I was like, this is incredible. So I had his blessing to go ahead with it.

(01:17:53)
He wanted me to illustrate it. He’s like, I want you to do it. I couldn’t imagine anyone else doing it. And so I just dove in and I’m still working on the moment. Unfortunately it’s taking a bit longer, but I want to make sure it’s perfect because A, it’s really the first opportunity I’ve had to work on someone else’s ip. And at the end of the day, I want to make sure that I continue that legacy that Matt has created with his story and his characters. So we’re nearly there. It’s nearly finished. I’m hoping by the end of November I’ll have it completed. But yeah, I’ve been working on that this year as well as a few other little projects in the background, but it really was a complete and utter, I was shocked to be able to continue the story. I thought it would concluded and I was able to come a story that continues, that legacy that he’s created and to have his blessing on it. It’s overwhelming and I’m excited to get it out to everybody. I think it’s a pretty special story.

Leigh Chalker (01:18:53):
Yeah, well, it’s a well respected character too, mate, from my understanding is very well received when it first came out. And certainly, and while we’re talking about him briefly, just so I can name drop him, if people dunno, was it the Bulletproof Kid was his other comic book that was very well

Kieran Jack (01:19:16):
Received? Yeah, so

Leigh Chalker (01:19:19):
I remember about him, man is I pick up copies of The Phantom too, dude, don’t worry about that. And man, he did a wicked cover maybe 12 months ago and it was the phantoms outline and a line in it. And I remember looking at that and going, damn, that’s a good cover. You know what I mean? And being really like, oh man, you’re on fire with that one. So yeah, no respect. Respect, but that’d be great, man, to get that sort of feedback from someone that is a mentor I would assume at this particular point in time and see you are creating and you’ve got your crew that you get advice from and throw ideas and stuff with. Would you think for any up and comer, because this, I mean, I don’t know if other people feel the same way, but just from me looking around and watching and hearing and listening to people and stuff, I sometimes tend to find that I was guilty of it because I came from a small town and didn’t have access to facilities like comics and things that could join people like you and I to talk about these things, you know what I mean?

(01:20:34)
And talk shop. But would you think that if you were a young creator that wanted to get into comic books, that it’s invaluable to reach out to people and get some advice from people, whether it be about your scripts or your artwork, how can improve what you can do? I mean, it’s obviously helped you.

Kieran Jack (01:20:54):
Yeah, I come from a bit of a DIY background also. I love punk music. So punk has never been about getting anyone’s approval. It’s always about doing what you love, putting it out there.

Leigh Chalker (01:21:10):
Exactly,

Kieran Jack (01:21:10):
Exactly. And as I’ve grown as a creator, I have learned the value of just giving it out to people and asking for a bit of feedback. It does help fill up something that you might’ve missed. And I think it really is. And at the end of the day, that’s why I started the podcast. The halftime effect was more or less basically built for people who were interested in getting into comics who didn’t really know how to, and talking to those people like what you are doing with this show, it’s like you’re talking to people who are in the industry and getting feedback and information from them being a sponge and giving something back to the community as well. And I think that’s invaluable. You’ve got to be able to help. You’ve got to be able to answer those questions and talk to people and communicate with how you got started and give them feedback.

(01:22:07)
Now in the later years of creating, I find it that I’m reflecting more on my peers and what they say than ever what I was before. There’s constructive criticism and there’s destructive criticism, and I try to steer away from any destructive criticism because I don’t believe in it. If you can give someone constructive criticism that helps ’em evolve and create the story and it’s even better than what they originally created, then so be it. But don’t ever tear anyone down for their opinions or views. I can’t stand it and I just can’t be a part of it. So yeah, at the end of the day, it’s really about trying to make sure there’s a community there that you can reach out to and talk to and get that information to create as well. If you wanted to get involved with it in any way. Art, writing, editing, producing, whatever it may be.

Leigh Chalker (01:23:01):
I 100% agree with you. The brilliant thing about what I’ve found on my journey with other people is look, everyone that creates comic books is a hero to me. Alright. It’s the path we all follow. Everyone’s roads are different, but creativity and stuff, I believe it’s an important thing for the souls creativity in that it certainly happens. And on my own journey, one of the things that blew my mind man, was coming into it and being, you get that for lack of a better description, I guess it’s thrown around a lot, but it’s something that people will understand is that imposter syndrome where you’re doing something that you don’t really feel like you a hundred percent belong. Yeah, I’m here man. So many people have been so welcoming and with opinion, some gentle, some not so gentle. You know what I mean? It depends on what level, I guess what tangent I suppose of teaching you.

(01:24:14)
You know what I mean? And what you gravitate towards. But I’ve been relatively lucky to have a lot of the people that I grew up reading comic books when I was a little boy, randomly sending them a message one day, you know what I mean? And suddenly finding myself having huge dialogues, man for long periods of time, it’s improved myself as a creator, as a writer, and as an artist for sure. Because sometimes, I mean, you can hear some things that in your mind you’re a bit, I don’t like that, and go and kick a bucket for a couple of days, you know what I mean? And you get grouchy, but then you come back to it with an open mind, then clear your head and you go hundred percent on that money, man. And then it’s just all general improvements. Man, I love hearing you’ve had that as well, mate, because I certainly have, from my mentors and stuff, I’ve been very lucky along the journey. So now you mentioned your podcast because from memory you got up to a hundred episodes on that podcast, didn’t you?

Kieran Jack (01:25:24):
Yeah, we just tipped over a hundred and it’s on hiatus as you know. It’s a big effort running a podcast and it’s not exactly live streaming. You’re basically going and you have to edit it and cut bits out and trim it down and do all to make sure the sound looks correct. So it’s a lot of work and I loved it. It was a fantastic way of getting it out there into the world and kind of getting creators on. Unfortunately we didn’t get you on Lee. Maybe if we come back anytime soon, we’ll have to get you on the show in reverse.

Leigh Chalker (01:25:58):
I’ll be there, mate.

Kieran Jack (01:26:00):
You can do your spiel on your work. But it was great to be able to talk to those people. No, no, not at all. We always loved having people on talking about their inspirations, what got them involved and spruiking their work and trying to get people involved with what they were doing. And that’s what I really loved about it was never about me. It was never about the work that I was doing. We had episodes every now and again where I’d talk about a project, but it was very sparse. It was more about everyone else that came on and finding out what they did. We had comic book store owners come on, which was great to talk to them about behind the scenes stuff you never see. And that was what I was really interested in. And I think by the time I got to, I think it was about the hundred fifth episode, it was very hard to juggle that and the comic books and because it’s a business, I had to kind of weigh up what was working and what wasn’t.

(01:26:57)
So unfortunately tonne effect had to take a backseat. So we put that on hiatus whilst we’re working on the business model for the comic books. And as that continues to grow, it’s kind of taken over, but there’s still that door open if we ever come back to the talking. So if we ever come back to the half tonne effect, it was the baby of how this has all came to be. It’s what started it. And I love it for that. And people come back to me and talk to me about that and they say Jackie was on before, he is like, dude, I listened to the podcast since the beginning. I think Spie even for a time there was listening to the podcast back in the early days. So that means something to me to be able to hear those people say, oh, we listened to your podcast when we were getting our start, and it was the thing that kind of pushed us out the gate. That means something to me that I know that that’s worked how I wanted it to. It’s helped inspire people to go out and create their own comics because it did it for me. It pushed me out the door to create my own comic book series and here we are today.

Leigh Chalker (01:27:59):
Yeah, no, that’s lovely man. They are talking about these sorts of shows. Well, we’re talking This is the Chin Waggon, this is the validity. Absolutely.

Kieran Jack (01:28:09):
Yeah,

Leigh Chalker (01:28:11):
It’s tricky. I’ve often had conversations with, to get one guest and line them up and then something happens and then you’ve got to rearrange things and then it’s not just the one guest you’ve got to change, but you’ve got things lined up coming down the road that you’ve got to reel back in and try, say you forever back forwards. And I’ve got to be honest with you, when I was doing, there’s probably a lot of people out there wondering why Chinwag iss not on every week, and this will segue into what we’re talking about. I guess here is an answer for ’em. I found that when you start, you’re like, why? Yeah,

Kieran Jack (01:28:47):
Yeah,

Leigh Chalker (01:28:48):
Man, every week and then you’re about 12 episodes and you’re like every week, oh man. It’s like, what? Oh dude, I need a break. It’s tricky as hell. Yeah, you work, you’re drawing, you got a life, you’re trying and have a balance. And I love, the thing is with Chin Waggon from the podcast that I heard of yours is I always found Chin LA’s Gestation I guess came from being part of Live Streams and that, and creators would get five or 10 minutes of a little bit of info and you’d be sitting there going, and then it’d be onto the next person. And in the back of my mind, I always thought, I really want to hear the rest of that story. I really want to hear where that person went to from where, and that’s why it’s like with Chin Wags and stuff, it’s like, man, it is what it is.

(01:29:50)
It’s like if it goes forever, it goes forever. If it doesn’t, it doesn’t. The fluidity to allow them to talk because the journey and the story man is everything. It’s not just the finished product at the end of the line, the tears and the efforts and the weights you lift and the people you’ve got relationships, husbands and wives and kids. I mean, there’s a lot of give and take with this stuff, man, for people to follow a passion that they’re compelled to do really. And for a lot of people, it’s just an independent thing they do for yourself. It’s a full on, this is what I want to do. As we can see, it’s all motivating, every story. It’s like you stick to your lane and you do it and you learn along the way. You take your bumps and bruises. It’s good man, and you pass on the knowledge.

(01:30:48)
It’s what it’s all about. And I enjoy it, man. I love it, to be honest with you. But yeah, every second week man for me is nice because it’s just a nice balance. I think you got to remember that too, in life I think is the balance of everything, mate, because it’s hard, fast, and burn down real quick, man, even if your intentions are for the best. I’m looking at it these days as a marathon man as opposed to a hundred metre sprint, man. So enjoy the moment. Like these moments, man, you enjoy them more I find, and you don’t have as much when it’s very, very regular. You sort of don’t appreciate and burnout. What’s that? I know that’s a machine, but you do appreciate the more men and you bring more energy and passion and love to what you’re talking about and stuff and listening to people’s worries. And that’s what I think is a great thing. Yeah, no respect with your podcast because I do know a lot of people used to listen to them. The one that I caught a couple of years back was, I mean the one that sticks out in my mind, but I used to while I was drawing listen to ’em as well, was the Day of Die one. And from memory, that’s the first time that I’d actually heard Dave die speak and talk about what he was doing. I’d met him here and there on,

(01:32:30)
Had appreciated his artwork, but hadn’t actually had any idea what the man was about. And when I heard that podcast, I was like, yeah, I like that fellow man and still is. I haven’t seen Dave in a while, so hello Dave, how are you mate? Well,

Kieran Jack (01:32:44):
That’s the thing. It’s meant to do that. It’s meant to connect people. And over the years I’ve found that there’s been people that have talked to within the industry and they’re like, oh yeah, we knew that person growing up. He taught me how to draw or that person. I tabled next to him at a convention and we had a great time and it was great to hear him talk about what he’s been doing since the last time I saw him. There’s always something that will come back up, and that’s what I loved about it. Again, you are right. I think by the end of it, I was recording six episodes a year. The last three seasons of it, I just recorded six to eight episodes back to back one night after another, and it was gruelling because you’ve got to do your research, you’ve got to read their comics, you’ve got to, and as you know, you’ve got to do your research about the creative that comes on, at least know what they’ve been working on and what they have. And then you’ve got to go in editing, you have to edit the podcast, and you’ve got to do the promotion for it. So it was a day’s worth of work and you mix that in with comic books and your daytime job and family and socialising. It was intense. So

Leigh Chalker (01:33:53):
Look, well see the whole idea of editing things, man, never really appealed to me. Hey buddy, how are you, Dave? Love you. Love that guy. As they say on the Friday night, drink and draw Champion artist too. The one thing, what was I going to say before Dave dies, so affectionately said, good day. Oh, this is where my brain goes, and we’ll come back, it’ll come back. It always does, but I am getting older. I remember things a week later, I’ll ring you up one day and go, Karen, is what I was going to talk about. Just flick.

Kieran Jack (01:34:32):
I’ll answer.

Leigh Chalker (01:34:33):
I don’t want to know about editing. I just like you just take the mistakes and the hits as you get ’em, man, you just got to, it’s about the risk. Half of the beauty of it.

Kieran Jack (01:34:46):
You say that, but then you go into editing,

Leigh Chalker (01:34:49):
But oh, well. It’s like, what do you do about it?

Kieran Jack (01:34:52):
Well, yeah, you hear some stuff on it like, oh God, why to ask that question? Or someone who’s a little bit nervous and their first time doing a podcast, you get lots of ums, ums and ahs. So I mean, I like to listen to a podcast, any good podcast, but one that’s got good editing, I was like, yeah, I’ll make sure it’s done properly. Can’t help that. So yeah, look, it was a labour of love. Labour of love. I do miss it. I do miss being able to talk to the guests and talk to people within the industry. So look, it’s on hiatus. It’s not saying it won’t come back, but you’ve got Chin Wags. I mean, you’ve carried the torch, now you carry the torch for productions.

Leigh Chalker (01:35:39):
Yeah, trying. We’ll see how we go, man. I don’t, honestly, I don’t even know what I was thinking when I started this, man. It seemed like a good idea. One day I had this,

Kieran Jack (01:35:53):
Didn’t know we say comics

Leigh Chalker (01:35:57):
Maybe, I dunno, actually, you’re probably right, but it was more, I know it would sound really strange, man, but because yes, to sell comic books, no doubt I’d be absolutely bullshitting to you if I said it wasn’t a part of it. Also was the fact that what I said to you earlier, I just wanted to give an avenue for people to tell their stories and because I’m interested in them and I figured if I’m interested where there’s one, there’s two where there’s two, there’s four. So it builds like that. The other thing is I’d met so many people that I admired that I thought didn’t have the opportunity to fully tell their story. You know what I mean? The first episode of Chinwag that I ever did was with Ryan Valer. Now whether Ryan Valer or not, I mean, this is a dude that, I mean man, beast of an artist, and he has been doing this stuff since 19 93, 19 94 mate.

(01:37:14)
You know what I mean? He’s out there in the world just churning through artwork and comics and minis and doing everything. And it was like, man, this dude’s got to talk to this fella other than me. And it started from that man, and then just slowly but surely, I started just really enjoying it and obviously meeting more people through it and getting, I suppose I’m getting a little bit more comfortable at it as you understand what it’s like. And really, I guess to a certain extent, Kieran, my love of Chinwag and what stories that I can help pull out of the guests that are on there has to a certain extent, my guest jumped up the scale of love for me over my drawing and comic books at the moment, man. So strange way of going about things, but I, we’ll come back. I’m very lucky man and very grateful to be able to do this and meet people like yourself and stuff and all the other 30 or 40 people that I never would’ve had an opportunity to talk to, man. So I’m very, very grateful man for the opportunity and the balance. That’s what I mean is every fortnight works for me, so I hope other people enjoy the chin wags and the talks as much as I do. Now we’ve got our podcast that is on hiatus that may be coming back, but you’re a busy man. You’re a busy, busy man. We’ll

Kieran Jack (01:38:55):
See you one day.

Leigh Chalker (01:38:56):
Yeah, we’ve got time, man. We’ve got time. Having said that, I’ve got time and a plane will hit me tomorrow or I’ll get shot. What’ll happen, my luck. I’ll get hit by a rainbow or man, be dead in the backyard tree or something. What an IGN mini to leave. That would be strange things happen, I guess. So now you’re in the middle of a gigantic project that we’ve touched base on earlier. So I want, I’m going to give you the total flaw here, man, because it’s on Kickstarter. Tell people how long it’s got left, how it’s going, where it came from, working with Logan French, who from memory was just on the short list recently at the ledgers or the Australian Comic Book Artist awards or I’m not very good with those sorts of names, but let’s go with the ledgers for Amphib. Actually saw a lovely rendition of Logan. He did a drawing a Rosy not too long.

Kieran Jack (01:40:17):
Yes, he did.

Leigh Chalker (01:40:20):
Surprises. So it was like, oh, gives you a little bit of a, which was

Kieran Jack (01:40:26):
Rick,

Leigh Chalker (01:40:27):
So hit me, man. Hit

Kieran Jack (01:40:29):
Me. Yeah, it’s funny. Laser Swamp came about, oh, it was probably a year ago. It was one of my old clients from my graphic design where I used to work previously, and they told me the story of, it was a mystery of Lay who lived out in Gippsland. She’s about 60 years old. It was, the story was, and she disappeared and they’ve never found her. It was basically a mystery to what happened. There’s been stories written, there’s podcasts, so I’ve always loved horror. I love comic books, but when it comes to the medium of film, it’s horror, easily. Horror. Horror.

Leigh Chalker (01:41:11):
What was your first horror

Kieran Jack (01:41:12):
That My first horror was Evil Dead too. Sam Rainey. Yeah. Yes. So watched it around in a mate’s house in an ungodly hour in the morning, and it just blew my mind. I think it was 10 10 or something. I was very good age. Yeah, good age to get in a horror. Yeah, 1997 I think it was, and it kind of looked the Fuse. I, I always loved movies and I was like, right, what else can, I was really good friends with the people at the video store, so I had my own video card, so I’d go in and rent videos all the time. So because I knew them, I was able to get things like Halloween Scream and Nightmare. I was getting all the horror movies and I started to really explore that. So I love the genre of horror over all film media and I thought, I want to always write a comic book story that is a horror, and I’ve been doing it for so long, why haven’t I done it yet?

(01:42:22)
Anyway, so I was like, stuff that I’m going to do it. I’ve heard about this story of Later Swamp, and I’m going to write a story based around this. It’s going to be a bit of a meshing of the mystery of what happened to her with a kind of an eighties style horror. Teenagers go to the property and then all these things happen. It’s a mystery. Supernatural Horror merged together. Logan had done a Fon Noir through halftime Productions. We produced it. I loved his art style. I’m like, this is the person I want to do it, because my art style was a bit too cartoony. I just didn’t feel like it would work. And so I pitched the idea to him, and Little did I know that Logan was a huge horror fan, but he was also a huge Evil Dead fan. So we smashed it out of the park and we started talking about the direction of this story, and yeah, it, it really is, and I think we spent an evening just talking over Zoom because he lives in Ballarat.

(01:43:24)
Sorry, Bendigo. I live in Wodonga, so it was a bit hard to be able to meet up at that stage. So I just sat down with him one night. We talked about all our favourite horror films, influences for the story, influences for the art, and it was really a match made, and so we basically dove in from there. He came up with a couple of concepts. I really dove into the script and thanks to Steven, Steven Cox, he came to me and said, there’s this great programme called Match Labs by Creative Australia and Australian government, which matches whatever you make on crowdfunding. They’ll double it for dollar for dollar. And so he gave me that a couple of years ago. I’d been trying to get it for a couple of other projects when we did the Talking Bread and Graphic novel format and tried it again this time and was successful, and so it kind of pulled the trigger on the project.

(01:44:21)
We were like, okay, now we have to go ahead and start getting this ready. So Logan threw himself in the deep end. I had the script basically finished within 10 days for the whole story. It’s a 96 page story. We’ve got it written. We’re just going through the final edit at the moment, but Logan’s already making his way through the page up, and we had to throw it on Kickstarter basically straight away. I went to a Match Lab’s clinic where I learned about how to publish yourself out in the world and push yourself out there with crowdfunding, even though we had experience with crowdfunding, it was kind of a really good eye-opener for me because it showed me some new things that we could be doing better. I’m always willing to learn new things that helps promote the business and promotes the comic books. So yeah, it was kind of all building up to this.

(01:45:12)
And then 14 days ago, we launched on Kickstarter on Halloween to coincide with Halloween being a horror story, and we nearly funded now, which is exciting. We’ve got stretch goals in place when we reach our target goal of $5,000. So for every dollar that we get from our backers, the governments are going to double it, dollar for dollar, which is incredible. I think you get around 20 people who are accepted into this grants programme a year, and we’re one of them. So we are absolutely honoured to be a part of it, and we’re not going to this opportunity slip past our fingers. We’re going to try and knock this out of the park. And yeah, we’ve got some great things on offer. We’ve got my variant cover for it. We’ve done a VHS variant cover, which is a homage to the classic VHS horror covers with the boxing around it and the R rating and the VHS logo and the very heavy set font that they had on there.

(01:46:17)
Box R and the chewed edges. The chewed edges, man. Yeah, yeah. Chewed edges and deteriorating and aged. Yep. It’s all on there. Logan’s got his cover. We’ve got a very well-established artist, Marco Elli, who is doing a variant foil cover for it enamel. I’ve got a glow in the dark enamel pin from it. Logan’s doing a day bill poster influence from scanners, the film. Yeah, we’ve really gone all out for this because it’s such a big project, and thanks to this initiative, we’re able to, everyone gets paid, including myself for the first time ever and working on a project, which is something rare that never happens. Bradley Aiden, who’d done super 80 Battle Armour, he’s lettering the project, which is great. It’s basically the full house of halftime productions working on this project, which is really cool. So yeah, the campaign finishes in 14 days. We’re about, I think $500 away from hitting our target goal.

Leigh Chalker (01:47:25):
So you hit that little, because Kickstarters have predominantly got that notorious big start. You hit that little, the lull, yeah, and the strong and stuff like that. Yeah. You feel good about having your whole half tone crew working with you doing it then

Kieran Jack (01:47:47):
It’s pretty incredible. Yeah. Yeah. It’s something, look, I’ve got a few letterers that I use, and I think it’s kind of special having Brad on board to do lettering for this. He’s an up and cover in the lettering world as well. He is been teaching himself how to do that, which is exciting. And having Logan on board to do the art. I mean, my God, we’ll talk about this previously, and having him there just to kind of send me pages that he’s working on, of the story I’ve written and I’m letting him have free reign. I said to him, I said, this is a script, but I said, if you feel like you can bring a page out with a panel that you see that needs to be a full page spread, I said, go for it. I mean, the world’s your oyster man, and he’s done that.

(01:48:34)
Some of the pages he sent me of the horror elements, it’s incredible. I’m so excited to get this out into the world because horror, I don’t know if you’ve ever dabbled in writing any horror, Lee, but it’s different to writing anything else that I’ve written before with horror. I think you’ve got to build up the tension for your reader, whereas in a film, you get a kill scene or you get a jump scare. Whereas in a comic book, you’ve really got to build the tension up and keep the reader hooked on that certain moment and then build up to your kill. So it was an exercise for me to build up to that and write up horror story. Yeah, honestly, it was tough. It really put me through the works and how I write my stories, which is great because I’m evolving as a writer, which you always hope when you’re creating new stories, which I’m sure you’re aware of, you want to push that forward, but then to give it to the artist and have the artist take your interpretation and just knock it out of the ballpark, it’s such a gift. It really is. And I’m really, really proud of this project we’re putting out. I actually really excited to get it out into the world. I’m kind of cracking the whip with Logan at the moment. I can’t keep those pages coming. Mate does a bit of fan art, does a bit of fan art. I’m like, where’s my pages next page. Come on, give me that.

Leigh Chalker (01:50:01):
That’s why when I mentioned that Rosie, that image, sorry. Anyway, that’s the businessman publisher in you coming out, mate. You know what I mean? The editor, you get that shit done, don’t worry about drawing.

Kieran Jack (01:50:26):
A hundred percent. A hundred percent. Yep. Look, nah, we’ve got an end date. We hopefully will have it all completed by. We’re still working on it, which is understandable. We only got the grant. We only got notified by the grant at the end of September, so we weren’t expecting to get it. So to get it was a real welcome surprise. So we kind of had to pull the trigger straight away because we’ve only got a certain amount of time to raise those funds, and we didn’t want to wait and sit around and wait for it. So we kind of had to go straight away. So it meant Logan had to jump straight into it, and I had to get all the Kickstarter and marketing ready for it around it. So it’s been a big two months, I’m going to say two months, getting it all together.

Leigh Chalker (01:51:11):
Yeah, for sure. But a project that’s coming off you from the sounder thing. One thing other than the book for other people that are listening and stuff, because Kickstarter is, I mean, it’s a fair way of getting your work out there because I guess comic book distribution and stuff like that has its ups and downs for all varying different reasons. Man, there’s not as many news agents, stock comic books, there’s not as many comic book shops. Unfortunately, COVID gave them a fair kick in the old peas mate and hasn’t helped out. But for anyone else, has not heard of this government initiative. Is it just a state government initiative, a national government initiative? Where would people go in future for themselves to put their own projects in there to see if they could, where would they go and how would they find that information then?

Kieran Jack (01:52:24):
Well, sorry, it’s a national initiative, so anyone can apply for it in the art sector. So it doesn’t have to be comic books, it can be film, television, music, performance, art, theatre. It can be really anything. The great thing about it’s you do a pitch for your project and the funding you are looking for. Now, you’re not actually primed to use Kickstarter. You can use as an Australian philanthropy website that you can actually go to where you can actually ask philanthropists to donate to your project, which probably larger scale, but with Creative Australia and the Match Labs programme, they will back your project dollar for dollar depending on what you are asking for. So we’re asking for $5,000 for our projects. They’re going to back dollar for dollar for that, so it’d be $10,000 we’ll receive in total for anything we make over that. That’s just icing on the cake really.

(01:53:28)
But if you wanted to go, if you had a $10,000 project, you would get, if you can raise those $10,000, they’ll give you a $10,000 on top of that. So you’ve got to be able to make that by the certain amount of time as well. And I think it is really about showing them that you can make that funding without just asking for the money straight up. It’s a bit of give and take I guess, in that sense. Yeah, for sure. So you just go to the Australian Arts, so you go to Creative Australian website and you’ll be able to find all the government grants that are going for the arts community. There’s an array of different areas that you can go for. It’s just about time you have to go there, but research what you’re looking for and reach out. There’s plenty of opportunity to talk to people within the industry and they’ll give you insight into what grant you should be going for.

(01:54:18)
I mean, Steven is one of the people who were fortunate enough to be a part of it in the previous years, and he was actually one of the stats they were talking about on the clinic that I went to. They were talking about the process that you go through with Kickstarter and all that, and that was really insightful as well. So yeah, it’s intense, but if you’ve got the time and the will to do it, you can definitely achieve it. We were able to achieve it this time around, but it’s a great programme to be a part of if you can get your hands on it.

Leigh Chalker (01:54:50):
Yeah, yeah. No, that’s an awesome thing because I’ve not heard of that, and that’s just like we were talking about before with Chin Wags. It’s like if you can get information like that from people that are willing to share yourself, there’s other people out there that may have not heard of it either. Just on the topic, when you said across say 20 creative, let’s say, yep.

Kieran Jack (01:55:25):
Projects, yeah,

Leigh Chalker (01:55:27):
Yep. Projects. How many comics would’ve been part of the 20? Because I take it it’s not 20 comics and 20 films.

Kieran Jack (01:55:35):
No,

Leigh Chalker (01:55:36):
It’s 20 total. And with your pitch that you were saying, was that an in-person pitch, or was that put your business proposal forward and send it off and it goes through the boardroom and you get a letter or an email saying approved?

Kieran Jack (01:55:55):
Yeah, it was a form you had to fill out. You had to do basically a pitch to what your project is and why you deserve to have this money. You have to have all your funding targets organised, so printing and shipping and all that ready to go, and then you go through the process. So they said to us, I think it was about 200 applicants they had for this one, and we were the 20 that was selected out of it, which was again, huge honour to be a part of. As for comic book creators, there was actually three comic book creators, Renee Fitzer, who is a comic book creator and writer and illustrator straight up. He was there as well. And then there was Philip Tarson, who has got future tales on Kickstarter at the moment, who is also a recipient of the Match Labs grant. So there was three people out of the 20. There was probably, I’d say about five or six people doing film with our directors or producers. There was a few other performance arts, and then there was a few people who were doing music, and there was one person there, it was an app based, app based creator that she was getting funding research for their project. Yeah.

Leigh Chalker (01:57:16):
Yeah. Fantastic. So

Kieran Jack (01:57:17):
Yeah,

Leigh Chalker (01:57:20):
Spectrum.

Kieran Jack (01:57:21):
Yeah. Yeah, definitely. It was interesting to talk to these people and get their insight to the industries that they’re working in as well, because we had time in between the actual clinic to talk to these people over the two days and get their insight and yeah, it was incredible. I would highly recommend that everyone in the comic book community do a submission for it, because if you can get it and if you can run a crowdfunding campaign to get your funding, it does make life a holiday easier for your project. I mean, this is a pretty big project that we’re embarking on at the moment.

Leigh Chalker (01:57:56):
Yeah, and I suppose all projects creatively are important and no less impact important, but this, I guess, gives it that little bit of extra we’ve been noticed here by to have this, so it gives you a little bit extra up and comments and a little bit more, a bit of a bigger tick mate. They pulled the Sharpie out as opposed to the old blacking pick. You’re sticking out. No, congratulations, mate. That’s great. Yeah,

Kieran Jack (01:58:33):
Thank you, man. Thank you.

Leigh Chalker (01:58:35):
The old Gippsland girl that disappeared. Is that just the premise of your story and you’ve made it all up the rest of it, you’ve filtered it in,

Kieran Jack (01:58:45):
I filled in the gaps, yeah. Yeah. There’s a bit of truth to the story. So we tell the story of the background of what the story is about and how it all came to be. Then we kind of bring bringing in the fiction of it as well, and the supernatural elements and the horror, and we kind of play off that and create our own story. I mean, Australia has a wealth of urban legends that I don’t think they’re not really touched upon, mean we’ve got true stories, stories. Wolf Creek is based off a certain story that happened here a few decades ago, and there’s great films coming out like Hereditary and The Babadook, and you’ve got also talk to me that this year it’s like a phenomenon around the world, these horror films that are all Australian based and comic books as well. I think they’ve always been there as a horror form of storytelling in comic books, but it’s kind of really started to take off within the mainstream publishing and also within the indie community. There’s a much larger horror comic book industry. So kind of bringing those two together, creating our story, that’s partially true story and also partially fiction and bringing it there. It’s been an absolute blast to work on this project rather than working on bread.

Leigh Chalker (02:00:14):
Yeah, yeah. This is the journey, man. This is the beauty of the Chin Bag. It’s like you’ve gone from telling us how you’re a baker and learning, implying your wares and half tone and the talking Bread, and getting to meet your mentors and how you’re learning your business and improving and getting your grants and using, I guess the avenues that are there. Learning Absolutely. Your conventions and you’re very free with your information, which is a lovely thing. I mean, knowledge for everyone is a good thing.

Kieran Jack (02:00:51):
Yeah, absolutely.

Leigh Chalker (02:00:52):
Housekeeping’s no good, man. I don’t understand why you’d want to see someone go through the troubles that you’d been through when you can just offer them a little bit of Hello Nathan, how are you doing, buddy? Thank you for watching.

Kieran Jack (02:01:04):
Hey, man,

Leigh Chalker (02:01:07):
That’s a beautiful thing. One thing I’ll come back to is Logan, just to touch base with him, because you said he’s worked with Half Tone, obviously with Amphib, and this is a half Tone productions question for you, you and Logan, how did you get together for Anir, and was that a case of he sent your proposal as you being a publisher and that sort of thing, you looked at it or was he someone you’d met through the conventions and you just clicked and

Kieran Jack (02:01:47):
Yeah, it was through a mutual friend. So Bradley Aiden, who’s creative super RBA Super Battle Armour, Logan tabled with us at a convention back in 2019, and he was a zine creator. He’d been creating zines, what longer than I been creating comics for.

(02:02:07)
And he had a comic book called Tofu there, and I was amazed by it. I was like, this should be a comic book series, man, not a zine. The quality of work you’re putting into these is far beyond zines, and I love zines. Coming from the punk background, I was like, zines are very much a punk rock thing, and you go to shows and buy zines. But I was like, this is a comic book, man. You should turn it and develop it. I’d love to bring it on the half tone label and pitch it to me. And he’s like, it’s his baby. He didn’t really want to do it at that stage, which I understand completely. And he said, but I do have another project called Amphibian Noir. And I was like, yeah, pitch it to me, man. So he gave me the zine and the premise of it, this is not taking anything away from what he’s created.

(02:02:59)
It’s batshit crazy, these frogs, and they’re assassins, and it’s got this real Blade Runner aesthetic. And I was like, it’s, I love it. Do you want to bring it on the Harth Harry production label and we’ll make a comment out of it? And he’s like, yeah, definitely. And I said, would you be interested in doing a graphic novel format rather than single issue? Because looking at kind of changing up the way we do things. And he was like, yeah, let’s do it. So we had some contracts site written up and kind of went from there. And he’s done some work for us on Talking Bread and Imp Purgatory, but he’s just come into his own with Amphibian Noir and it’s great. And great friendship’s being built from that too. Logan’s a good friend, consider a real mate, and to have him a part of the team and we’ve got a little half their own productions chat channel that we kind of jump onto and throw things up and talk.

(02:04:04)
And Brad and Logan have got their little podcast or live stream. They do. They just talk about Munger. They’re both obsessed with Munger. That’s through halftime productions. I just gave him the chance to do that if they wanted to. And yeah, he is become a real part of the team, which is great. That’s what I wanted to do. It’s not just about, this isn’t the big leagues, this is just a small little production company. It’s a group of people that all have the same interests and same common agendas, and we just want to build friendships along the way and kind of grow from there. And extra on top for them is that they’re creating the comics and I get to take ’em around the countryside and promote them at the conventions and sell their work to people they probably wouldn’t have met before. And we go the comic book stores and all that. So yeah, Logan’s a great contributor to the team. Yeah.

Leigh Chalker (02:04:53):
Yeah, it’s beautiful. And much like most of your favourite punk bands, no doubt half Tone Productions is creating a lovely little chemistry from the sounds of things, mate. Make your friends and stuff like that. So, oh, here we go. Shane’s chucked up. 90% funded. So come on peeps. Let’s drive this awesome project over the line. And there your Kickstarter address. I will attempt to read it PN anyway, I give up. You can just read that on screen.

Kieran Jack (02:05:24):
Just click the

Leigh Chalker (02:05:28):
Links.

Kieran Jack (02:05:31):
It’s a web address.

Leigh Chalker (02:05:33):
Yeah, it’s the web address. Whatever Kieran knows you can find everything for. It’s all over Facebook, it’s all over half tonne productions. It’s all over Kieran, Jack. It’ll be all over MX and stuff like that and share it around and go home, man. So it gets all of its funding. I think it’s a beautiful rounded out story, Karen, to be honest with you tonight, what you’ve spoken to me about man is your beginnings and dreams and starting off from being a huge norm, brave Fogle fan, and Alan, Alan Grant fan is immediately like with me because as I said, they’re my Batman crew that I loved as a young fella as well. Seeing all the work that you’ve done, man, seeing the fact that even over the last couple of weeks promoting the Kickstarter, you’ve been doing the run, ma’am. You’ve been doing the tour like podcast and all that sort of stuff.

Kieran Jack (02:06:34):
That’s the other side of it. Yeah,

Leigh Chalker (02:06:38):
I’d be busy, man. The promotion side of things and pushing it all out and stuff like that. Yeah,

Kieran Jack (02:06:44):
There’s two big things that are on the horizon and it’s been kind of happening in the background whilst I’ve been doing this. So at least to say that I’m a little bit sleep deprived at the moment when it comes to the other projects whilst we’ve got this going on as well. So it’s all fun. Look, I live in, breathe it. So I am thriving off the

Leigh Chalker (02:07:05):
Moment. There you go. Would you rather be anywhere else?

Kieran Jack (02:07:09):
Absolutely not. I’m enjoying the ride. Enjoying the ride better than being stuck in front of a 300 degree oven on a summer night in a bakery.

Leigh Chalker (02:07:19):
Yeah, I can dig that. Alright, so as we wind down our show, I’m going to ask you the question mate succinctly as you can. Two parts of it, little ki comes up to you at the convention and he’s looking at you and he asks you one question, why do you do it and why should I do it? It says Little Kiran.

Kieran Jack (02:07:53):
I think it’s why should you do it? It’s for the enjoyment and the love that you had as a kid. It’s for the ability to express yourself through the art that you are creating and to be able to tell your stories through the art you’re telling. This is one probably art that I’ll add onto it. Don’t ever listen to the teachers or the people who tell you not to do it because you’ll get a lot of those people that will tell you not to do it. Don’t listen to those people because it’s worth it. There are good times and there are bad times, but god damn, it’s good fun. I love doing it. I love doing this. Things like this. Getting to talk to you, Lee, tonight has been an absolute joy. It’s part of the ride. It’s not just sitting there making the comic or writing and illustrating it’s about the ride and you enjoy the ride while you can because it ain’t last forever. But yeah,

Leigh Chalker (02:08:47):
Absolutely.

(02:08:49)
I love what you say there because it is, it’s all part of the journey and you’re a hundred percent right mate, because if we listen to everyone that has ever said not to do something or don’t do something, you just wouldn’t get anything fucking done. So if it makes you happy and it’s the way you want to go in life, as long as you’re happy, man, that’s all that matters. And I’m looking at my guest tonight, ki and Jack, and he’s a very happy man. So Auntie Amanda, good on you. Honestly, I wish you every success. Thank you, Ray. And one of the beautiful things about Chinwag is that a gentleman that is a mentor to me, oh, Nick Ray, teacher crush and dream since 1873.

(02:09:47)
It’s had, doing live streams and creating comics isn’t just about the creativity on the page as well. It’s also about representing yourself in a live stream sense or in public. And I’ve been lucky enough that the guests on s Chinwag present themselves and are very nice people. Ki your enthusiasm tonight, man, your commitment to the cause, seeing where you’ve come from, man, being a young fellow with a dream and pushing on through man, having being honest with your ups and your downs. Just plugging away, man, telling it like it is, mate, for me, having never met you before, I’m going to keep an even closer eye on where you go with yourself.

Kieran Jack (02:10:32):
Cheers, man.

Leigh Chalker (02:10:33):
All good. And you have absolutely motivated me man, and I hope other people feel exactly the same way out there. So thank you very much man, for coming on Chinwag, it’s a great pleasure and beautiful, beautiful.

Kieran Jack (02:10:49):
Absolutely. Yeah, cheers man. It’s absolute blast to come on and actually talk to you, be on the show. I’ve watched the show for ages now, so it’s great to be actually come on and chat to you. So yeah, thank you man. Thank you very much.

Leigh Chalker (02:11:02):
Yeah, thank you man. It’s great. Reason why I do it man, is to help out and meet you mate, so it’s brilliant. Alright, so that’s our show. There’s a couple of little things that we’ll talk about this evening. Thank you to Bo and the guys over at Aussie verse for showing live streaming chinwag on the Tuesday night. It’s the first time we’ve done that tonight, so I hope it was a success with everyone and I hope everyone enjoyed the show. Kieran, again, I wish you every success mate and Logan and crew and halftime productions and stuff and keep on plugging away, certainly motivating me from your output, mate, you’re giving me a good kick up the bum. Cheers.

(02:11:50)
Look, another happy birthday to Siz. Thank you mate, because Comex and everything’s provided for me and all the people that I’ve met through Comex over my time doing this. It’s provided me with plenty of opportunities to meet people, create comic books and be part of the community and it’s a great pleasure and great honour. So happy birthday to you buddy. The last thing I would always say, and I always like to end this on, is mental health is a huge area that I put a lot of emphasis on, not just for myself having been through it late and over the last couple of years, but also for everyone else out there. The world can be pretty brutal and doesn’t get any easier. Some people do feel isolated, particularly artists who can be introverted or creators who can be introverted, don’t have a lot of people to talk to sometimes struggle to reach out to people.

(02:12:51)
Now, I can definitely tell you from my experience that if you feel that you haven’t seen any of your friends or family or spoken to them in quite some time and you feel within your intuition or your thought processes that you should reach out, then please do. Because a phone call, a text message can save a life. And in my case, they certainly can. I can test for that. So to everyone out there that’s doing a tough, everything gets better. You just got to pull your shoulders back, pull your head up. I know it’s a lot easier said than done, but there are people out there that give a damn reach out, communicate. It’s the most important thing. Look after your people, look after your friends and family. Kindness does not cost anything. And at the end of the day, kindness is really the only thing that matters. So for everyone else out there across the Aussie verse, across Comex, across Halftime productions, ki and Jack, thank you very much and take care. Be kind and community is unity. See you in two weeks. Thank you.

Kieran Jack (02:14:03):
Thanks guys.

Voice Over (02:14:04):
This show is sponsored by the Comex Shop. Check out Comex CX for all things Comex and find out what Comex is all about. We hope you enjoyed the show.